Should I Sell Investments To Pay Off Debt? (Hour 3) - Transcripts

January 23, 2023

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George Kamel & Ken Coleman answer your questions and discuss: Dealing with tax debt, "How picky should I be in my job search?" Credit scores and why you don't need one, "I'm scared the economy is going to collapse and the government will take my money". Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 Weekdays from 2-5pm ET Want a plan for your money? Find out where to start: Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts: Learn more about your ad choices. Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy


Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions broadcasting from the pods moving and storage studio it's the Ramsey Show where America hangs out to have a conversation about your life and your money. I'm Ramsey Personality, George Camel joined by Ken Coleman this hour. The phone number to call is 888-825-5225. This is a show about you and your life and you doing meaningful work and living a debt-free lifestyle and having incredible relationships. That's what we're here to help you do. Thank you. Joshua kicks us off from New Mexico this hour. Joshua, welcome to the show.

Yeah. Hi. How's it going? Good. How are you? Good. Good. Okay. So, I'm 24 years old. I work in real estate. My wife's a nurse here and we have five investment properties and then we have our primary residence. We have three vehicles, two still have loans on them.

And I guess the gist of my question is should I sell my investment properties to clear pretty much all my personal debt? And I think I'd have about $40,000 left on my personal mortgage. So, how much do you have in consumer debt? You said you have two car loans. Anything else? Two car loans. I have taxes coming up, which I actually didn't save for. I didn't do a very good job. I just over spent. We bought a few investment properties this year and we just over invested

that money. And we have a budget on the way. How much are you going to own taxes?

And we have a budget on the way. I'm going to know about $47,000.

Whoa. That's a whole lot of not paying taxes. You're paying taxes. Yeah, it is.

How much are the car loans? I owe about $55,000 on my truck and then $18,000 on my lifestyle.

What's your household income?

I, total household income is probably about $320,000 a year.

Wonderful. Wow. How much is each car worth on the $55,000 truck? How much is the truck worth?

That one's pretty new. It might be worth $54,000, $53,000. I'm probably barely under on that one because I barely bought it a few months ago. Guy, what about the car? And then the family, that one's worth about $26,000.

Guy, what about the car? And you owe $18,000 on it?



Well, I would sell the cars before I would sell the investment properties. It's a whole lot less of a hassle. Okay. So, if you sold, how much money do you have in the bank?

Sold. How much money do you have in the bank? We have, total, about $32,000, $33,000. Oh, great. Okay. So, we have to have money to pay these taxes. Are they due April? Yeah. I'll probably file an extension. This is the first day I'll probably have to do that. And I guess that was one of my kind of questions also. Would it be smart to maybe set up a temporary payment plan so I can pay them off this year without having to sell?

Are you working with a tax pro currently? Yeah.

Okay. And what has been their advice? I haven't got advice specifically on this yet, because I guess it is the first year where I didn't do a very good job of saving for it.

I would go ahead and get this out of your life instead of kicking the can down the road. You'll have the money once you sell these cars, and you can get two cheaper cars.

You can get two cheaper cars. Okay. Yeah. Well, if I did that, because I don't have a ton of equity, so even if I sold the Camry, I would keep 7,000, 8,000, and then the truck. I wouldn't make anything probably on that one.

Yeah. You could just net zero on that. You'd have 8K plus 32K. That gives you 40K. Okay. And now we still need two cars. And so, we're going to get two very reasonable used cars. They're not going to be fancy like the ones you have right now, but it's temporary. But George, I'm curious why you say you wouldn't sell at least one of the properties. You can do that. Do you have a lease favorite? One that's giving you the most hassle?

Not worth the cash flow?

They've all been pretty solid, actually. I just pretty well on them. But yeah, there's definitely some I would have in mind that I would sell before another. Do you own all these cash? No, no, no. They all have mortgages. They all cash flow pretty well, and it can run you through the numbers if you wanted to, but they all have mortgages on them.

I'd be curious so George could get the whole picture because George, I'm not sure why he's not selling all the houses. You stand to make money on all of them?

Yeah. And so, like I said, I can run you through them real quick.

So, we have five houses or four? Five investments and then just my primary. Okay. Yeah. Run through them real quick. Are we good with this, George? Yeah.

So, run through house number one. How much do you owe on it? How much could you sell it for? Okay. House number one, I owe about $147,000, and I could sell it about $255,000. House number two, I owe $145,000, it could sell at about $235,000. Okay. House number three, I owe $74,000. It could sell it at about $110,000. Another one I owe $112,000. I could sell it at about $220,000. Okay, last one, I owe 162, that one is probably about 212.

And just for fun, your personal house, how much do you owe in your home? 395. All right, George, I'm genuinely asking here. Well, he's got some serious equity here

and he can clean all of this up. If you're willing to sell one of the investment properties, it would put you in a much better financial situation. And I might do both, I might sell both cars and sell a rental property to really set you guys up for success. And the thing with the cars is, it's a depreciating asset versus the homes, which are going to appreciate at least. I don't love that you went into debt for five properties, but it's less risky than these cars continuing

to go down in value that are toys. And I might Do both.

I might sell both of the cars,

it's a depreciating asset. Yeah, well, and my concept was that these cars would last us 10, 15 years down the road that way. We have a kid on the way, which is also why I'm trying to get together financially.

I'm gonna be more aggressive than George, if it's me. I'm selling the houses, I'm cleaning all this up,

paying off my paying off money. The one you owe 112 on that's worth 220, that would clear six figures for you.

Yeah, I'm selling that. Now you got nice paid four cars, baby on the way, I'd be super aggressive.

The cars aren't a large part of your world as far as income goes and so either way something's gotta give, either we sell one of those properties to clear the car debt

or we sell the cars to clear the car debt. So one issue, and it's not a drastic issue per se but if I were to sell a car, I would have to cause I'd depreciated them on my taxes, so I would have to reclaim it.

Oh, tax money on that.

Yeah, but that's not a reason to stay, it's not a reason to stay in debt.

You're gonna have the cash to pay your taxes. Yeah, but that's not a reason to stay, and you gotta stay on top of it with these taxes.

Is your tax pro helping you do this? He is, yeah, and he's really good. He's been on it. Like I said, this was the first year I just, we bought three investment properties this year, or last year alone, I guess. And so with 25% down, we just overspent on investment properties.

Yeah, I pumped the brakes on the investment guru stuff and work on paying these off, and you may just wanna snowball them. And what's your mortgage left on your primary? 395. Okay. Yeah, I might snowball some of the smaller properties first and then work on attacking that personal one. And by the end of this, if you keep this up, you'll have a bunch of paid for properties that are cash flowing, no payments in the world, and a whole bunch of money in the bank. I like that plan. But with a baby on the way, nothing will get your button gear like a baby coming into the world. I'd sell them all. Hey, I'm a fan of Ken's move right there.

It'll definitely sell every one of them. I'd sell them all. Sell every one of them. Knock out as much debt as you can. Eventually, you're gonna get back into it because you know how to do it.

But do it in cash. And whenever you have left in cash, yeah, you have a few hundred thousand left over. All right, let's go pay cash for some real estate. Love that plan. This is The Ramsey Show. This is The Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by Ken Coleman this hour. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Jesse's up next in Knoxville, Tennessee.

Jesse, welcome to the show. Thank you.

How are you doing? We're doing great.

How can we help? Well, so I'm graduating from college in about three and a half weeks. And I've been job hunting for the last few weeks. And I'm wondering if I'm being too picky

with which jobs I take or look at. What is making you feel like you might be being too picky?

So I've gotten a couple bites mainly in sales positions, which I'm not particularly interested in anyway. And I just can't imagine myself doing anything like that and not being absolutely miserable,

which is the main thing I want to avoid. That sounds like some self-awareness. Tell me what it is about you that you feel like a sales job would just be awful.

What is it? I am a very brutally honest person. And I've, in my experience at least, salespeople always kind of have to be like, fakely nice or over exaggerate how good the product is. And that's just something I wouldn't want to do.

And yeah. What about the performance side of sales and the kind of the pressure?

How's that hit you? Yeah, oh, I think I'd be good at it. My main fear is being sort of like my parents were, where I come home from work every day and then like just cry myself to sleep because I'm doing something I hate. There we go.

I want to avoid that. There we go, Jesse, you're my kind of guy. That's why I work, is to help people find work that they're really good at that they love.

All right, so what do you want to do? See, that's the thing. I'm not really particular with what I want to do.

I just don't want to do something I hate. Okay, so you've been in college almost four years.

You getting ready to graduate from UT, I'm guessing? Well, I'm graduating a year early,

but no, I'm graduating from University of Phoenix. Okay, all right. Oh, okay, gotcha. So you said you're brutally honest, so am I. I don't believe you. And I'm calling you out because I want you to feel the confidence to tell me what it is you're thinking about doing. I don't believe a guy like you, who's as serious as you are, saying some of the heavy things you're saying, doesn't have a couple of ideas, something he's wondered about, but he's just got some fear or he's got some doubt. I don't believe that your mind or your heart is a whiteboard. So what are you thinking about? What's the thing that comes up all the time?

Come on, Jesse. I genuinely don't have one. Like I've read through your book in every sense. And the only thing I could really come up with was like fatherhood or maybe game development. Okay. Like super specialized and would take forever.

And I know, I know excuses, but like. Yeah, so you actually answered my question and you proved that what I said was correct. You think gaming is something that's very interesting, but it feels unattainable for you. It feels like it's not worth all the trouble. Yeah, basically. Okay, what about gaming interests you? The function of the work, is it programming, coding?

No. What is it? No, it's more like design,

figuring out how things would work together. Okay, so something that, let me ask you this. What have you always found that you have been able to do pretty easily? Came easy for you and people complimented you for it.

Hmm. Don't over think this. I would say I probably, probably teaching people how to do stuff. I worked in manufacturing for a few years. Now I hated it. I was really good at training people. Did you, did you. Quality assurance.

I actually have to work for QA at one time. Don't overthink this. I would say from the quality assurance. Did you, nice.

Did you enjoy the training part?

Yeah, yeah, I'd like teaching people how to do stuff. Okay, there's a clue. There's a clue in the fact that what interests you about video game designing is the design element. Those are all clues. What we've got an example of is something that you're naturally very gifted at, which is communication and connection. That's the training element. And you enjoyed the result of that, seeing somebody's light bulb come on, do it better. You took some satisfaction in that. Those are all clues. And then the design element, that's very interesting. Maybe it's an aesthetic. Maybe it's the analyzing.

I'm not sure. But when you're looking for ideas on what to do, and by the way, I'm gonna give you my get clear career assessment because it's gonna pull stuff out of you. But I'm gonna venture to say you overthink some stuff. Is that true?

Yeah, probably.

I'm trying to get through them. Yeah, I get it. Listen, I'm a recovering over analyzer myself. But what we wanna do is we wanna, when you're somebody who's overthinking everything, we wanna detach the brain and we wanna go to the heart. So here's a quick exercise, George. Can we do this on the spot? Let's do it. All right, here's the deal. Jesse, you gotta answer quickly, no thinking. You ready? Yep. Who are the people you most wanna help?

What comes to mind? Say them. Who are they? My wife. Your wife? Oh, jeez. Yeah. You can't go Hallmark on me. Outside of your wife and the Good Husband Award, who are people in this world, you think I'd like to help these people?

What comes to mind when I ask the question? People who don't know how to handle money.

People who don't know how to handle money, fantastic. All right, we're gonna come at the same problem different ways, different question. You ready?

What is the problem or desire that they have?

Probably not knowing how to budget, I guess. Right, maybe some discipline issues, maybe some bad habits around money. And then finally, what's the solution to people who have money problems

that you get most excited about providing?

Seeing our light bulb go on. Does that have anything to do with training or instructing? I mean, yeah. Yeah. Does it have anything to do with maybe analyzing

and designing a plan or a program or a way to connect to them?

Yep. What do you think? Yeah, I'd say so. So we got something, right? Now here's the deal. I want George to weigh in on this too, because George has been around me a long time. George walked a very similar path that I did professionally. He gets this idea of talent, what we do best, passion, what we love, mission, what moves us, what results motivate us. I'm gonna give you the Get Clear Career Assessment. When we put you on hold and my book, From Paycheck to Purpose, you give it to somebody else. I know you've read mine, but I'm gonna give it away as a bundle, but I want you to take the assessment and then remember this conversation that we had, because we just walked through some clues.

George, any thoughts? He's spot on right there. I mean, it sounds like he's leaning towards some level of financial coaching, maybe on the side.

Or certainly being an advisor, a financial advisor,

maybe teaching financial curriculum. The next step, I'd go, do I know anyone who'd let me just shadow and just pick their brain over coffee and see what they do and just see?

If that stirs you up. I mean, you could be a smart investor pro down the line and train and guide people. You could teach on the collegiate level. You could teach on the high school level. You could go work for a company in HR and bring in our smart dollar program and be the person that leads that. But there's some themes here, Jesse, that you've got to pay attention to. And what we just did for people that are brand new to the show and like, what was this guy doing? When you're trying to figure out what it is you wanna do with your life professionally, don't miss that there is this emotional component to work. Love, in other words, relationships and work, our occupational life, they share the same result. It's about serving others. People that are happy in their work, it's not about their paycheck. But a fat paycheck, it makes me happy.

But it's never just about that. It's about the contribution. I feel like I'm serving people.

I'm making a difference in the world, George. Well, there's something about the education system. As Jesse's talking, I'm going, what a broken education system where people get out of this whole thing after doing it for, what, 18 years. And they're going, I have no clue. And so that part frustrated me for Jesse. That he spent all this money in school, got a degree and is still walking out going, no one prepared me for what's next. Which tells me there's some personal responsibility

and that the education system needs some overhaul. So now watch what happened with Jesse. This was really cool. So he's presenting on this phone call. He's going, Ken, I literally have no ideas at all. I knew he did, but we went back a little bit. What always came easy for you? Like for those of you out there that feel like you have no idea what you want to do or you're trying to figure out, begin to look at who you are. So what if people always complimented you on doing, or it came easy for you, saw somebody else struggle in school in this thing. And you were like, this is easy for me. We're just getting to, I'm talented here. And there's going to be a connection between what I do well, talent, and something that I enjoy.

In fact, we humans, George don't like

to do anything that we suck at. That's true. It's only fun for a little bit. And then we go, it's not fun when it's really difficult forever. Exactly.

That's why I don't golf. That's why I don't golf. That's why George doesn't golf. He's a bismol.

Absolutely abysmal and it's no fun. But I was beating you at mini golf one time and I still hold it over your head.

There's a backstory on that. There's a backstory on that. That's probably a separate episode. The front story is I beat you at mini golf. Yes, you did. That's all you care about. Hey, Jesse, hang on the line. We've got the Get Clear Career Assessment, which is going to get inside your head and your heart and give you some confidence and some clarity.

Love it. Yes, you did. That's all you care about. Hey, more of your calls coming up. 888-825-5225. This is The Ramsey Show. I'm George Camel here with Ken Coleman. This is The Ramsey Show. We're here for you, America. Well, guys, if you're wondering, maybe you're looking to buy or sell a home this year and you're not sure about this housing market, well, here's what I'll tell you. There's still more demand for homes than there are homes to buy. The median home price is expected to keep rising, but at a slower rate.

And interest rates likely aren't going to stop going up. So what does it mean for you? Well, if you're buying a home, you're still going to face some competition and big price tags. And if you want to sell your home, chances are you can still make a nice profit, but you have to be patient for the right offer to come your way. And of course, this depends on where you are. Every market is going to be wildly different. And it's why you need to work with an experienced real estate agent when you're ready to start this home buying or selling process. You want someone who's done this hundreds of times before and knows how to negotiate a strong deal based on the current market. And you can find those agents, we call them Ramsey Trusted Endorsed Local Providers on our website. These are the top performing agents around the country who we trust to serve you well. If you want to connect with one of those agents, just go to slash agent. That's slash agent.

Micah joins us up next in Charleston, South Carolina. Micah, welcome to the show. Hey guys, how's it going? We are doing great, man.

What's going on with you? So I'm currently here in Charleston, Wob station here, US Navy. I'm looking at getting the rest of my enlistment bonus gonna be about 18 grand and then re-enlisting in a couple of months for anywhere between 80 to 120,000. Half of which I'll get upfront and the rest in payments. And I wanted a little bit of advice on how to be smart with my money. I'm currently sitting on roughly $40,000 of combined student loan debt and car debt. And I was thinking about paying it off 100%, just getting rid of it, having zero debt left behind, but all my friends and everybody I know is telling me that I shouldn't pay off my car because I should hold on to that.

And have it help build my credit. They want you to hold on to debt to build your credit. Yes. Are they making your payments on the student loan in the car? No. Then they don't get a say. And the reason the credit score exists is to vet people to go into debt.

Do you plan on going further into debt? The only other thing I plan on taking money out for

is a house. A mortgage, great. You can do that without a credit score. And I tell you that with great confidence because I did it. And it's called a no score loan through a process called manual underwriting. Our friends at Churchill Mortgage, they do these every single day. And what they do is they take a real look. That's why it's called manual and not automated underwriting because a real person looks at your financial picture and says, hey, Micah's made on-time rent payments for a year. Micah's paid his cell phone bills and insurance bills for a year. Micah's income to debt ratio looks great. We're going to give Micah the mortgage. It's about that simple.

People try to overcomplicate it. They try to steer you away from it. They tell you it's way more expensive. It's so difficult. It's really that simple. And so I would pay off all of this debt and I would never look back. Cause again, the only reason you want that credit score

is now for the mortgage, right?

And we just went over why you don't need it.

Any other concerns about the credit score? Not really. I mean, it kind of got trashed about three or four years ago. I didn't know what I was doing with stuff and I've been working it up from about 300.

It's in the six hundreds now. Okay. So a bad score can and will hurt you when you go to get the mortgage. So the goal here is we're going to pay off all of the consumer debt, close all accounts, cut up all the credit cards, close those accounts if you have any. And over a period of time, six to 12 months, while you save up your emergency fund, your down payment on the house, it's going to take you that long, right? A year or two, three? Yeah. Your credit score will become indeterminable. So it probably won't go all the way down to zero. It will just disappear eventually to where when you go to check your score, it will say indeterminable. Gotcha. And by the way, there's other things people will tell you you need it for, like buying a car, which you don't need if you're paying cash.

So save up and pay cash for used cars. You don't need it to rent a car. Just check the policy with each rental car company. You might just need to have a little buffer in your checking account, because they may add a hold if you use a debit card. Gotcha. And then even renting homes. I've rented multiple homes and apartments with no credit score. Because what they're looking for is a bad credit score to show, oh, this person doesn't make payments on time. No score doesn't say that. Gotcha, gotcha.

Does that help you?

Yeah, yeah, that helps a lot. Okay, tell your friends to go watch this clip. And maybe you guys can sit down and listen to episode seven of the fine print. It's called the dirty truth behind your credit score. And I break all of this down in nerdy detail. I talk to mortgage lenders. I call apartments and landlords at random all over the country and ask them if I can rent without a credit score. And I hope it helps just squash this myth and mythology that you need a credit score

to live your life. Gotcha, I'm gonna make sure to show my friends that.

Absolutely. Well, thanks for the call, man. And thank you for your service in the Navy. It's awesome. You sound like a bright young man making fantastic money. Let's get rid of all this debt, get the emergency fund, begin building wealth for the future, and never look back. All right, let's move on to Courtney in Boise. Courtney, welcome to the show.

How's it going? It's going. So I have zero debt, no credit score. So when they pull my credit score, it doesn't exist, which is great. I have a fully funded emergency and some money put aside for a nice down payment. I'm running into issues, being able to rent or especially buy because I've also simplified a lot of my bills. So I'm having issues even qualifying

for that manual on a writing. And why is that?

Have you asked them why you're not qualifying? Yeah, so they said that they want at least four lines of bills. So like a cell phone, insurance, utilities.

Yeah, and I-

Like a cell phone, insurance, utilities. Don't buy anything. I always try and pay in cash right away. So I don't have those monthly payments.

So you're paying in cash for like your electric, so you're paying in cash for like your electric bill

and your water bill? Yeah, so I have my rent and my electric bill. All my other utilities are paid through rent. And so it only counts as one line.

As one line, okay. So how many lines do you currently have? So how many lines do you currently have? You've got two, so if we needed two more, are there other normal monthly payments you're making

like insurance premiums, anything like that? I pay for my insurance at the beginning. So I'm being told that that doesn't qualify because I don't have those monthly bills. So I can create, I can create those monthly payments instead of paying up front. But like, for instance, my internet, I do prepaid because I get it for quite a bit cheaper that way. But then because it's prepaid, that doesn't count as a line. Okay.

What lender, okay.

What lender have you contacted so far for this? I've gone through probably,

I've spoken to at least five different lenders in my area. Okay.

Have you tried calling Churchill yet?

I have not. I would give them a shot. Call Churchill Mortgage. They're licensed in your state and get their opinion on this and they can give you some good hard facts on exactly what you need to do to do this in the shortest amount of time possible. You said you have full down payments saved already?

How much is that?

Yeah, I have just under 50,000. Okay. So worst case, you might need to rent and keep these lines going for another six to 12 months and then get the house. But that's only gonna put you in a better buying position when you have a bigger down payment. It opens up your options. So it stinks that you're going through this. I'm sorry to hear that, but get these new lines open. You might need to switch to monthly payments because that's what they're looking for. It's just consistent monthly payments. And if you have that across those four lines, you should be in good shape to get this mortgage to the manual underwriting process. So wishing you the best. Call our friends at Churchill Mortgage.

They'll be happy to help you. Tell them we sent you. They'll treat you right. Thanks for the call, Courtney. This is The Ramsey Show. This is The Ramsey Show. Our scripture of the day comes from Lamentations 3, 22 and 23. The steadfast love of the Lord never ceases. His mercies never come to an end. They are new every morning. Great is your faithfulness. Eleanor Roosevelt once said, with the new day comes new strength and new thoughts.

Brent joins us up next in Salt Lake City.

Brent, welcome to The Ramsey Show.

Morning. Glad to be here. Thanks for having me on. Sure. How can we help? Okay, I have some cash, which it's about $55,000 in my credit union. And I'm really afraid of this economy, the way it sits right now. So... What are you afraid of?

The collapse.

What are you afraid based on? Well, yeah. In the past, you know, I mean, in past history, the bank, the government has come in and shut down banks and taken people's money. Granted, it's been a hundred years ago, basically, you know?

I mean, it could happen, couldn't it? Anything could happen, but what's likely to happen? You think all of your money is gonna disappear

in that bank and could happen? Well, I have a lot more in that bank than just this cash. And it's insured, correct?

It's insured, correct. Up to $250,000 per person on the account? Per person.

Do you have more than that in one account? Per person.

Do you have more than that? Well, I have two separate accounts in stocks and...

Well, you can't be that scared. Well, you can't be that scared since all your money's there. What's the fear driving all this?

All of a sudden, it's the fear. Listen to Ollie's YouTube videos, I think.

Yeah, so that's, yeah. So, Brent. Fear-mongering, click bait, YouTube videos.

Yeah, I mean, if that's, listen. Yeah, yeah. If that's all you do is pay attention to conspiracy theories and all these things that could happen, then it's gonna absolutely impact you. And so, I don't wanna discount what your fears are, what you believe, your philosophies on government. I don't wanna get down into that, but I would say this. The worst, I mean, you start concocting the worst case scenario, could it happen? I guess. Who knows the percentage chances? You can't argue about that, because no one knows the percentage chance of any of that happening, but could it happen? Sure, but what do you, I mean, living life requires you to make some smart decisions based on the realities of what's working, the stock market, mutual fund performance. All that stuff has got history, and that's what you know. But deciding what to do with your money based on something that you don't know is gonna happen, that doesn't get you anywhere at all.

So, unless you're planning to go to a bunker somewhere and live off of the chickens and off-grid and bury your money in coffee tins, then you know what to do.

You know what to do with that money. Yeah, I know.

I- Stop watching the YouTube apocalyptic videos, first of all.

That's why I've been watching you instead. That's good, we gotta head on our shoulders, and we don't do fear-mongering. Well, is there a question underneath all of this

that we can help with today? We don't do fear-mongering. Well, and I've got a, I just retired, and now I've got a 401k that it's gonna, I've gotta do something with two, half seen a Roth and half of it's seen as a traditional, that, you know, do I take it out,

or do I just leave it there and let it ride? Well, do you need the money?

What are you living off of right now? No, both my wife and I retired, I just retired the first, or the end of December. Combined, we live off of about 8,000 a month. And where does that come from? Her retirement from government, and my retirement from social security, and-

So between the pension and social security,

you guys aren't even touching retirement accounts. Oh no. What's the total of your nest egg? With our house,

so our house is paid for basically.

What's the house worth? Six, was worth eight at the high peak.

So 600,000?

What do you have in retirement accounts?

Probably close to 400. Okay. But it sounds like from the pension and social security, you guys are covered,

so that 400 can continue to grow? Yeah. Yeah. I would let it ride.

I just don't want to lose it. Yeah, I would let it ride. Well, I mean, you'll have required minimum distributions on those,

eventually, on the traditional side.

Yeah. So that's the only thing you'll have to worry about, but you're not going to lose it. It's not going to disappear into the abyss. Worst case, do you have any kids it'll be passed down to? Do you have any kids it'll be- Yes. Okay.

Well, that's a great blessing and legacy for them. Yes. For them. Is it a good thing to set up a trust,

and get everything put into a trust at this point in time? If you'd like to, if there's a very specific way you want this money distributed with terms and conditions and some strings attached,

then it's a wise thing to look into. Yeah. Yeah. Plus I have insurance, you know, my life insurance and- Do you have a will in place? We have a living will right now, but it's fairly old.

We need to do something and update it, I'm sure. I'd get all of that in order, and I would sleep well at night and get off the YouTube channels, Brent. You're doing great. You guys have a great retirement income, even without touching those accounts, but I'd just let it ride. And there's some great tax strategies you can use with the Roth versus traditional side, so I'd connect with a SmartVestor Pro if you want to figure out how to best utilize that money down the line. All right, let's take a quick one here from Anne. Anne, we're right up against the clock. Get to the question.

How can we help today? Okay, so I'm close to 60, my husband and I. We have zero debt, we own our home free and clear. I still work, we both still work.

What do we do with our money?

So the income you have coming in, or do you have savings? We have savings. I currently contribute 30% of my pay into my retirement account, my 401. Awesome. And my husband puts money in. We have about 20 in just our regular savings account. And, you know, our living expenses are practically nothing,

so I probably have about 3,000 disposable a month. Great. Well, there's only three things you can do with money at the end of the day. Give it, save it, and spend it. And I would suggest you do all three. And so find something you're passionate about. Maybe it's your local community, local church. Maybe it's a global mission, an organization that's doing great work, and give there. And then find some spending goals. Do you guys do fun things? Do you like to travel?

Do you have any hobbies? You know, we haven't done much of that.

We say we're going to, but we never do it. I know you're typing. You guys have worked so hard your whole life, penny pinching, and it's hard to let go and enjoy some of it.

Anne, where do you wanna go? I want to go to Canada.

There we go, there we go.

Where in Canada? I don't really know. I'm big in Quebec. I would like to go and see Canada.

We just booked your next trip. We just booked your next trip. Fantastic. You're out in Seattle, Eric. Why don't you go up to Vancouver and then make your way across the lovely country and end up in Quebec. Very French, very fun. But I mean, start to map this thing out.

Let's go, you got some money. Start to dream with your husband and go, what's all the things we haven't done yet?

Might I suggest someplace with less rain and warmer temp? There we go.

In Seattle. There we go. In Seattle. And then find some hobbies. If there's something you've always wanted to do or something you used to love to do that you haven't had time to do.

What's a hobby you wanna do? And I keep saying that I wanna do that when I retire, but I'm still working and I'm saving that for the retirement years where I can give full 100% of my time to a cause which is. Well, you can do that part time right now. Yeah. I can.

I can't. You've got vacation time. You can do that part time right now.

You've got vacation time, right? I do. When do you guys think you'll retire? I wanna work until I'm 70. I ain't doing anything. I love it. But I do.

You're talking with the right guy here with, I love it. You're talking with the right guy here with Ken Coleman, that's a great thing.

As long as you've. Ken Coleman here. That's a great thing to want to do.

As long as you take some trips. Yeah, you guys are doing great on the saving side, Ann. And so I would just look at give and spend side and go, let's have some goals where we force ourselves to spend some money here and give some there. That will make you feel balanced. So you're not just penny pinching until you go, what did we do all this for? Let's live like no one else. That's what this plan's about. That puts this hour of the Ramsey Show in the books. My thanks to Ken Coleman, all the guys in the booth. We've got Ben, we've got Austin, James, Zach, Andrew. Everyone's in there and you America, you're out there listening and we love you for it, and we'll be back real soon on the Ramsey Show. Hey, it's George Camel.

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